PHILOSOPHY, add yours-a work in progress-

[soserious]

we had a good philosophy thread in the old CC.
this thread is for you to add your philosophies wether simple one line or an entire abstract text.
feel free to elaboate on any, discuss and even try some out.

let me start by quoting a few simple ones , some of which i heard, some i made up but im sure others aleady made up too ect.
add your own stuff, it doesnt have to neccesarily sound deep or anything, look at this thread as also anecdotes on life experiences and give your advice if you like too.


"he who asks is a fool for 5 minutes,
he who never asks is a fool forever."


"the beggining is as relevant
as the middle and the
end and all inbetween"



ss

[Valk]

Here's a cheesy one:

"Its not the goal that counts, its the journey"

[Shane_Bos]

Carpe diem, seize the moment, cross the bridge when you come to it etc.

You know, dont plan life too much, improvise life, its more fun to be spontaneous (to an extent)

[Clockers]

A bird in one hand, is better then two birds in a bush. :mrgreen

[Shane_Bos]

Id rather have 2 birds anywhere than just one. Well, depends on the bird i suppose. Na, Threesome! :mrgreen

[Clockers]

lol

[hugh g rection]

A true friend stabs you in the front.

To live, is to suffer, to survive is to find meaning and to suffer.

Both Lord Acton as far as I know.

[bubbahotep]

i'm a sucker for these kind of threads, live each day as if it were your last, and all we are is what we leave behind. those are the main maxims i live by. :)

[wern]

I think, therefore I think

[soserious]

"the journey of a thousand miles must begin with a single step"


"never leave dog/child /person in a car on a hot day"

[Ordo Ferrum]

One word:

"procreation"

The meaning of life :wink:

[soserious]

great stuff guys! :D

Bobo said one, i forget exactly what it was but he said it was better in Finish anyway. something like:

"dont take too long taking your next step-or you will be standing on one leg your whole life!"

where is Bobo anyway? is he ok ? :?
i hope he`s ok, maybe i should email him- but then maybe he needs a break from cc and stuf.
hmm.

wheres Oldie aswell?


"what was once can never be"


"the past is past, but the present is..present"

"we`re gonna come here,
we`re gonna conquer,
we`re gonna kick some!"

ss

[Clockers]

Yea! Where is bobo & oldie!!! :?

[Shane_Bos]

"dont take too long taking your next step-or you will be standing on one leg your whole life!"

Thats a version of what i said. That you should improvise life and take each day as it comes. If you're stuck planing everything, it wont be fun, like standing on one leg. (Unless you've got an ice cream cos then standing on one leg with an ice cream would be cool)

:cool

[Bobo]

This one would really change this world if people would understand it:

"It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not."

[Spike]

"Work is the curse of the drinking classes"

[Shane_Bos]

I experienced that one this morning Spike. Went clubbing last night, got in at 4, woke up at 7, still drunk, to go to work :D

[soserious]

given that we are born,
and given that we die,
what choice do we have?


if you cant have the best of everything,
make the best of everything you have
(i love that one)


if you always do what youve always done,
youll always get what youve always got.

(saw that on a ronnie coleman vid)

ss

[soserious]

"Change is one thing,
progress is another..."

[Ed]

«Busy, busy, busy is what a Bokononist whispers whenever [he] thinks about how complicated and unpredictable the machinery of life really is." The books of Bokonon and Kurt Vonnegut

[Bobo]

"If before the mission has begun it has already been exposed, the spy and those he informed should all be put to death"

Sun Tzu - Art of War

[Valk]

Great book!

[Bobo]

True, a wise book it is. Lots of practical everyday survival hints and tips to all.

[soserious]

"you`re damned if you do,
you`re damned if you dont"

"the bigger the front the smaller the back"

[BIGOKE]

[QUOTE=soserious]given that we are born,
and given that we die,
what choice do we have?


Best one so far, ha ha ha ha :lol: :lol:
Thanks ss


Hey what did I do wrong? WHy didn't the quote turn red??? And by the way what are REP points, how do you get them and how do you give them and whats the point? Sorry so ignorant... :puke: :puke: :puke:

[BIGOKE]

Definition of insanity:
Waking up everyday and doing the same things over and over..... and expecting the world to change!

[soserious]

heheh, thanks- i made that one up myself.
you need to highlight what you want quoted from beggining to end- then click that square speech looking bubble on the right of the edit/make post screen. then it should work. you seem to have only used 1 qoute marker at the front-you need one at the end o the quote also.

the reps thing, actually i dont know to be honest. but i know that if someone likes a post they can add reps points to the poster* and if they dislike it they can neg rep it/you/me/anyone.

i havent repped you at all yet- weirdly it says i cannot rep you again yet. again?
i was gonna pos rep you but it wont let me yet.

ss

[soserious]

"We pass this way but once,
there is no normal-there`s no such thing as normal!
There`s you-and there`s the rest,
there`s now-and there`s forever,
do as you damnwell please!"

*billy connoly*
i dunno where he got it from or if its his own.

ss

[Katsz]

See things for what they are, not for what you want them to be.

[MagnumXL]

'do not mistake my kindness for weakness' just a quote i like nothing really to do with the thread

'it is only when we have nothing, that are we truly free to do anything'

i guess just quote i like... bah

[soserious]

"it never rains everyday"

[BIGOKE]

An apple a day is no good to you if you don't eat anything else..

[Clockers]

lol

[Tiger_Penis]

"There is no try, there is only do and do not."
--Yoda (I am sure he wasn't the first to say it but this is where I learned it)

In the end I am doomed to fail, that is the end of my story. But the end isn't here yet and until then, I fight.
--I said this to my friend one night when he asked why he should continute on.

"Let that shit that does not matter truely slide."
-- Fight Club, I think.

[Godma]

A bird in one hand, is better then two birds in a bush. :mrgreen

Or as I like to childishly muse: A load on the face is worth two on the bush.

[Clockers]

:mrgreen

[soserious]

Baz Luhrmann's "Everybody's Free"
Ladies and gentlemen of the class of '99

Wear Sunscreen-

If I could offer you only one tip for the future, sunscreen would be it. The long-term benefits of sunscreen have been proved by scientists, whereas the rest of my advice has no basis more reliable than my own meandering experience...I will dispense this advice now.

Enjoy the power and beauty of your youth-oh, never mind, you will not understand the power and beauty of your youth until they have faded. But trust me, in 20 years you'll look back at photos of yourself and recall in a way you can't grasp now how much possibility lay before you and how fabulous you really looked. You are not as fat as you imagine.

Don't worry about the future; or worry. But know that worrying is as effective as trying to solve and algebra equation by chewing bubble gum. The real troubles in your life are apt to be the things that never crossed your worried mind; the kind that blind side you at 4pm on some idle Tuesday.

Do one thing everyday that scares you.

Sing

Don't be reckless with other peoples hearts. Don't put up with people who are reckless with yours.

Floss

Don't waste your time on jealousy. Sometimes you're ahead, sometimes you're behind...the race is long, and in the end, it's only with yourself.

Remember the compliments you receive, and forget the insults. If you succeed in doing this, tell me how.

Keep your old love letters. Throw away your old bank statements.

Stretch

Don't feel guilty if you don't know what you want to do with your life....the most interesting people I know didn't know at 22 what they wanted to do with their lives. Some of the most interesting 40 year olds I know still don't.

Get plenty of calcium

Be kind to your knees. You'll miss them when they're gone.

Maybe you'll marry, maybe you won't. Maybe you'll have children, maybe you won't. Maybe you'll divorce at 40. Maybe you'll dance the funky chicken on your 75th wedding anniversary. Whatever you do, don't congratulate yourself too much or berate yourself either. Your choices are half chance. So are everybody else's.

Enjoy your body. Use it every way you can. Don't be afraid of it, or what other people might think of it. It's the greatest instrument you'll ever own.

Dance. Even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room. Read the directions, even if you don't follow them.

Do NOT read beauty magazines. They will only make you feel ugly.

Get to know your parents. You never know when they'll be gone for good. Be nice to your siblings. They are the best link to your past and the people most likely to stick with you in the future.

Understand that friends come and go, but for the precious few you should hold on. Work hard to bridge the gaps in geography and lifestyle-because the older you get, the more you need the people you knew when you were young.

Live in New York City once, but leave before it makes you hard. Live in Northern California once, but leave before it makes you soft.

Travel

Accept certain inalienable truths: prices will rise, politicians will philander, and you too will get old. And when you do, you'll fantasize that when you were young, prices were reasonable, politicians were noble and children respected their elders. Respect your elders.

Don't expect anyone else to support you. Maybe you have a trust fun, maybe you have a wealthy spouse; but you never know when either one might run out.

Don't mess too much with your hair, or by the time you're 40, it will look 85.

Be careful whose advice you buy, but be patient with those who supply it. Advice is a form of nostalgia. Dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts, and recycling it for more than it's worth.

But trust me on the sunscreen.

i love that song: i was the class of 99.
and also the class of 97 technically, i remember hearing it on the radio in my room when i was wallpapering my bedroom.
such memories.
:cry: :cry: :cry:
feel like crying but i wont.

what happened to me. :cry:

[Shane_Bos]

I liked that song too but i was too young to appreciate what he was actually saying i suppose.

[Valk]

I hate that song, I makes me feel so soft. :cry:

[Bobo]

This one works well with PE too:

"When they see potential gain but do not know wether to advance, they are tired"

Sun Tzu - Art of War

[Valk]

"Your first impression is bad because of my looks"

"Your second impression is bad because of voice"

"Your third to infinite impression is bad because of my personality"

Mr. Suicide

[soserious]

hmmm

[Aux]

i'm studying philosophy at university, and this thread is NOT philosophy, it's merely a list of proverbs (and some proverbish quotes).

these common proverbs usually make me laugh and cringe at the same time because of how cliche they are, and how people ramble dozens of them daily without ever taking a moment to think what they actually mean and whether they are meaningful.


but enough with the bitterness, some proverbs are very very good. simple, well thoughout proverbs can be very inspiring.

[soserious]

you just did the equivalent of walking into a bar, full of roughneck killers and told us we`re all morons who dont know what we`re saying..
http://www.fanboyplanet.com/ontv/images/termburn.jpg
whats your next move Aux?

and yes we`re aware of the difference between proverbs and true philosophy, however we dont get hung up on thread titles.. we`re free flowing and creative like that.

soserious

[soserious]

hahaha
btw welcome to CC Aux :wink:

[Katsz]

Proverbs are fun. Because every once in a while, someone says something that really does make you think about it, even if it's only one out of 50 sayings. And then you think about it, and it makes sense to you. And even if you only consider it for a few seconds, at least you had that, which is better than nothing. It could be meaningless, or it could change your life.

And that's what makes this thread a good one.

[Godma]

i'm studying philosophy at university, and this thread is NOT philosophy, it's merely a list of proverbs (and some proverbish quotes).

these common proverbs usually make me laugh and cringe at the same time because of how cliche they are, and how people ramble dozens of them daily without ever taking a moment to think what they actually mean and whether they are meaningful.


but enough with the bitterness, some proverbs are very very good. simple, well thoughout proverbs can be very inspiring.

How about you rattle off some of your philisophical studies then.

[hugh g rection]

i'm studying philosophy at university, and this thread is NOT philosophy, it's merely a list of proverbs (and some proverbish quotes).

these common proverbs usually make me laugh and cringe at the same time because of how cliche they are, and how people ramble dozens of them daily without ever taking a moment to think what they actually mean and whether they are meaningful.


but enough with the bitterness, some proverbs are very very good. simple, well thoughout proverbs can be very inspiring.

Proverbs are a personal philosophy Aux. When you say studying philosophy at uni, I really hope you mean as a non major or some kind of intellectual excercise. Philosophy majors either teach or spend a lot of time giving out unwanted views of the world.

I enjoy philosophy as a mental excercise but other than that you have to realize it is basically worthless.

[Aux]

Proverbs are a personal philosophy Aux. When you say studying philosophy at uni, I really hope you mean as a non major or some kind of intellectual excercise. Philosophy majors either teach or spend a lot of time giving out unwanted views of the world.

I enjoy philosophy as a mental excercise but other than that you have to realize it is basically worthless.

have you ever actually read a philosophical work? because you couldn't be more wrong. i don't even know where to begin, saying philosophy is worthless is like saying that asking questions or even learning is pointless. do you even know what philiosophy is?


How about you rattle off some of your philisophical studies then.

"i think, therefore i am" - Renee Descarte, an old one but a good one and everyone's heard it before(i probably spelt his name wrong). This thinking pretty much started the whole metaphysical philosophy of the existence of internal and external world. the quote is forever being used improperly and out of context though.

it has been expanded on and sort of proven wrong since then though. philosophy works like that a lot though, someone will write a philosophy then someone will point out the flaws and correct it in their own philosophy, and someone else will do the same again. continually improving.


Edit: Descarte was also a big influence for The Matrix

[BIGOKE]

Holy cow someone trying to murder our thread?? I like it flawed the way it is. I don't give a shit even if someone makes something up. Do we really care who said what and why and... WHAT THE FUCK?????? :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:

[soserious]

Holy cow someone trying to murder our thread?? I like it flawed the way it is. I don't give a shit even if someone makes something up. Do we really care who said what and why and... WHAT THE FUCK?????? :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:


good old BIGOKE, :D

[zwmusic]

have you ever actually read a philosophical work? because you couldn't be more wrong. i don't even know where to begin, saying philosophy is worthless is like saying that asking questions or even learning is pointless. do you even know what philiosophy is?




"i think, therefore i am" - Renee Descarte, an old one but a good one and everyone's heard it before(i probably spelt his name wrong). This thinking pretty much started the whole metaphysical philosophy of the existence of internal and external world. the quote is forever being used improperly and out of context though.

it has been expanded on and sort of proven wrong since then though. philosophy works like that a lot though, someone will write a philosophy then someone will point out the flaws and correct it in their own philosophy, and someone else will do the same again. continually improving.


Edit: Descarte was also a big influence for The Matrix

To begin with, his name was RENE (with an acute accent on the last 'e') DESCARTES (with an 's').

The cogito comes from latin 'cogito ergo sum' but his original quote was in french 'je pense, donc je suis'.

Go back to your philosophy classes.

[Valk]

C'mon guys. Keep the friendly atmosphere.

[Aux]

To begin with, his name was RENE (with an acute accent on the last 'e') DESCARTES (with an 's').

The cogito comes from latin 'cogito ergo sum' but his original quote was in french 'je pense, donc je suis'.

Go back to your philosophy classes.

what's with all the ego and hostility? i made it clear that i probably spelt his name wrong, and im well aware of the origins of the quote, i didn't go into such irrelevant details for fear of sounding like and egotistical bastard.

[soserious]

so anyways Aux, what part of the world are you from and hows life?
CC is has a "small town feel" about it and to come in with a first post with negative overtones (at least seeming) was unlucky.
but theyre a really good bunch of guys here. we just get pissed sometimes.

ss

[zwmusic]

i'm studying philosophy at university, and this thread is NOT philosophy, it's merely a list of proverbs (and some proverbish quotes).

In this case stop trashing a thread which is for people to join in with the level of knowledge they have. If you want to patronize people, do it elsewhere mate.

[Aux]

so anyways Aux, what part of the world are you from and hows life?
CC is has a "small town feel" about it and to come in with a first post with negative overtones (at least seeming) was unlucky.
but theyre a really good bunch of guys here. we just get pissed sometimes.

ss

im from Australia, sorry for the 'seemingly' negative undertones of my first post but i assure you they were unintentional.

In this case stop trashing a thread which is for people to join in with the level of knowledge they have. If you want to patronize people, do it elsewhere mate.

im not trashing anything, i pointed out an error, that in itself is not negative in any way. and im not being patronizing, that would be your misinterpretation.

[Aux]

and for the record, to call someone patronizing after posting this...

To begin with, his name was RENE (with an acute accent on the last 'e') DESCARTES (with an 's').

The cogito comes from latin 'cogito ergo sum' but his original quote was in french 'je pense, donc je suis'.

Go back to your philosophy classes.

...is a tad hypocritical.

consider this constructive criticism, there's no need for this to be an argument.

[zwmusic]

You've made your point. Move on.

[Aux]

good,

i like your avatar zwmusic, we should have a music somthingorother thread, if there isn't already one.


and to get back to the topic, my personal favorite...

"Love will laugh at a locksmith"

[Godma]

"i think, therefore i am" - Renee Descarte, an old one but a good one and everyone's heard it before(i probably spelt his name wrong). This thinking pretty much started the whole metaphysical philosophy of the existence of internal and external world. the quote is forever being used improperly and out of context though.

it has been expanded on and sort of proven wrong since then though. philosophy works like that a lot though, someone will write a philosophy then someone will point out the flaws and correct it in their own philosophy, and someone else will do the same again. continually improving."

Meh.

René Descartes, A.K.A The Father of Modern Philosphy, clearly wanted to eliminate the uncertainties of philosphy and create a more concrete system of thought - almost mathematical in its construction.

His main problem was that he thought Man was the dog's bollocks and that the universe revolved around us. Hence his very stupid theory that all animals did not follow his "Cogito ergo sum" theory, but instead were to be considered automata...machines.

For this reason, this guy doesn't float my boat.

Regardless, most of philosophy isn't nearly as profound or interesting as you'd imagine. Which is why I think the guys at CC preferred (knowingly or not) to just say some of their favourite proverbs and life mantras.

[Aux]

yes that's what he was after, somthing undoubtable. but i didn't see any reference to animals in his "Meditations on First Philosophy", where this philosophy we're discussing comes from.

animals have pretty much been seen as inferior since around 300-400BC when Plato, Socrates and the rest of the ancient greek philosophers decided 'reason' was the paramount condition. they also used it to justify killing their enemys by simply saying they're barbarians and don't possess the ability of reason.

though i really don't agree with this, anyone who's had a pet dog will know its just like a human that can't talk.


and i've read a lot of philosophy, and its much more profound and interesting than i imagined.

[zwmusic]

i like your avatar zwmusic, we should have a music somthingorother thread, if there isn't already one.

Thanks Aux, I like Beethoven. To me he'll always be the symbol of freedom of thought, his music talks about our innermost feelings and its symbolic dialectic is as actual as it was when he composed.

There have been threads about music and musical taste. Mostly directed towards pop, hip hop, and Afro-American suburban styles.

I'm more interested in classical and jazz.

There are some very good musicians around, like Valk and jocko.

[Valk]

There are some very good musicians around, like Valk and jocko.

Hahaha! Then you obviously haven't heard me play. :lol: :wink: :roll:

[zwmusic]

:wink:

[BIGOKE]

[QUOTE=zwmusic]Thanks Aux, I like Beethoven. To me he'll always be the symbol of freedom of thought, his music talks about our innermost feelings and its symbolic dialectic is as actual as it was when he composed.

Howzit ZW,
I'm not so into classical music, but the inspiration from Beethoven for me comes from the fact that he was able to compose entire symphonies despite being totally deaf. :shock: Yet every note in all those symphonies is absolutely perfect, and he never had the opportunity to hear them. Awesome man!! :D talk about feeling and living the music. In my opinion he's right up there with Einstein in terms of genius.

[Aux]

[QUOTE=zwmusic]Howzit ZW,
I'm not so into classical music, but the inspiration from Beethoven for me comes from the fact that he was able to compose entire symphonies despite being totally deaf. :shock: Yet every note in all those symphonies is absolutely perfect, and he never had the opportunity to hear them. Awesome man!! :D talk about feeling and living the music. In my opinion he's right up there with Einstein in terms of genius.

zwmusic can probably correct me if im wrong, but i don't think he ever wen't completely deaf, but i do know that he cut off the legs of his piano so he could pound the shit outa the keys and put his ear on the floor to hear them.

[BIGOKE]

He was completely deaf for the last 10 years of his life. Before that he was renowned as pianist and when he started to become deaf he had to give up playing and retreated into composing. Deafness overcame him slowly and he became very depressed in later years.

[BIGOKE]

Say something on your own behalf, your silence allows others to dictate your life by default.

[zwmusic]

As BIGOKE said, Beethoven was stone deaf at his later stage of life. That was the period he composed his most deep felt and most brilliant music. Just one word for him, GENIUS!

[BIGOKE]

Say something on your own behalf, your silence allows others to dictate your life by default.

By the way ZW this was not directed at you, it was just an attempt to try and get the thread going again. I hope it did not offend you.

[hugh g rection]

have you ever actually read a philosophical work? because you couldn't be more wrong. i don't even know where to begin, saying philosophy is worthless is like saying that asking questions or even learning is pointless. do you even know what philiosophy is?




"i think, therefore i am" - Renee Descarte, an old one but a good one and everyone's heard it before(i probably spelt his name wrong). This thinking pretty much started the whole metaphysical philosophy of the existence of internal and external world. the quote is forever being used improperly and out of context though.

it has been expanded on and sort of proven wrong since then though. philosophy works like that a lot though, someone will write a philosophy then someone will point out the flaws and correct it in their own philosophy, and someone else will do the same again. continually improving.


Edit: Descarte was also a big influence for The Matrix


Yes I know what philosophy is and it is essentially worthless except as a mental excercise. It is just studying other peoples ways of comprehending life. If you really want to throw down about this I can start qouting off all the different works I have read and written papers on smart ass.

You haven't been on this site long and you come off like a snooty asshole in one of your first posts. Not exactly a socially smart person are ya?

[Aux]

Yes I know what philosophy is and it is essentially worthless except as a mental excercise. It is just studying other peoples ways of comprehending life. If you really want to throw down about this I can start qouting off all the different works I have read and written papers on smart ass.

You haven't been on this site long and you come off like a snooty asshole in one of your first posts. Not exactly a socially smart person are ya?

I still say you don't really understand philosophy if you think its worthless. So much of the western world is governed by philosophical works.

It is just studying other peoples ways of comprehending life

An average philosopher describes the world, a great philosopher changes it.

If you really want to throw down about this I can start qouting off all the different works I have read and written papers on

I would love a philosophical discussion, as long as it remains ego free.

[BIGOKE]

I still say you don't really understand philosophy if you think its worthless. So much of the western world is governed by philosophical works.



An average philosopher describes the world, a great philosopher changes it.



I would love a philosophical discussion, as long as it remains ego free.


OK AUX
We didn't start this thread to get a degree in Philosophy. All we want is just to find profound sayings that we find, amusing, life changing or just plain dumb. We don't care if someone famous coined it or if we pulled it out of our own arses. It is actually meant to be fun. Not the freaking Dead Poets Society. Your manner in the very beginning seemed very condescending, and for the most part unappreciative of the purpose of the thread.

But if we have to go there then I have a few questions
1. What is the true meaning of Philosophy? Is it a thought by an individual. Is it a way of life? Does it apply to everyone?

2.Can you be a Philosopher if you haven't studied the subject?

3.Can not having a Philosophy be a Philosophy.

[Shane_Bos]

Cmon guys give Aux a break, he probably likes and studies philosophy and Hugh just said it was a bunch of crap. Its like if you're a football player and you love the game then someone says its the worse game in the world, you're going to defend it.

I doubt he meant to offend anyone, lets just start over.

Hugh this is Aux...

Aux, meet Hugh...

Shake hands and play nice.

[Aux]

Thanks Shane

But BIGOKE

1. What is the true meaning of Philosophy? Is it a thought by an individual. Is it a way of life? Does it apply to everyone?
The true meaning of philosophy is a very long winded, and i'd have to go researching to give a fully correct answer. Philosophy literally means the love of wisdom, but thats sorta not what its really about, philosophy is seeking the truth.

Yes i guess its thought of by the individual, or by discussions or whatever.

I don't understand what you mean by 'is it a way of life' like do people devote their life to it? yes. but other than that im not sure what you mean.

And yes, it does apply to everyone, philosophy is always looking for universal truths.

2.Can you be a Philosopher if you haven't studied the subject?

Yes, just like i can try to fix your broken leg if im not a doctor. Studying it will improve your comprehension of it, and more importantly, it will give you many oportunities to take part in discussions, which is vital to philosophy.

3.Can not having a Philosophy be a Philosophy.
Yes, it's generally called 'Nhililism', Michel Foucault and Friedrich Nietzsche are two famous philosophers who some what say there is a truth but it is not necessary, and there is no purpose, that sort of thing.

[BIGOKE]

Is it a thought by an individual. Is it a way of life? Does it apply to everyone?

I guess I mean like can you say the following is a philosophy for a way of life?
Live each day as it comes.

And can a philosophy be a principle of life or not? and what's the difference?

[Bobo]

1. philosophy examination of basic concepts: the branch of knowledge or academic study devoted to the systematic examination of basic concepts such as truth, existence, reality, causality, and freedom

2. philosophy system of thought: a particular system of thought or doctrine

3. philosophy guiding or underlying principles: a set of basic principles or concepts underlying a particular sphere of knowledge

4. set of beliefs or aims: a precept, or set of precepts, beliefs, principles, or aims, underlying somebody’s practice or conduct

5. calm resignation: restraint, resignation, or calmness and rationality in a person’s behavior or response to events

6. education the liberal arts: the branch of learning that includes the liberal arts and sciences and excludes medicine, law, and theology ( archaic )

7. attitude, viewpoint, idea, thinking, way of life, values, beliefs

(from MSN encarta)

[zwmusic]

By the way ZW this was not directed at you, it was just an attempt to try and get the thread going again. I hope it did not offend you.

I know, it did not offend me in any way. I just didn't want to pursue the Descartes issue any further.

[BIGOKE]

I know, it did not offend me in any way. I just didn't want to pursue the Descartes issue any further.
Great, I thought I sounded like an ass hole.

Perhaps I was a bit too critical of AUX before, I didn't want to start a fight but his comments did needle a bit. But I suppose he has a point and anyway I of all people should take the opportunity to learn some new culture,seeing as I know squat about the subject. And what would a forum be if we always had to agree with each other? No fun in that.

Bobo your post was very enlightening, it certainly answered my question. Ta :D

Methinks some very deep posts are lurking in the horizon. :idea:

[Aux]

I guess I mean like can you say the following is a philosophy for a way of life?
Live each day as it comes.

That's sorta missusing the word philosophy, it is using it correctly in the sense of common speech though. I know the word 'philosophy' is used like that a lot, like "my philosophy is 'the world we create is the world we live in'", but that's more of just an opinion, or a prefence, someone thinks they'd be better off by following.

It doesn't have any reasoning to it, it sounds good and makes sense, but there is no evidence of how it was rationally defined, no argument.

And can a philosophy be a principle of life or not? and what's the difference?
I'm not sure what you mean by this.


The first of Bobo's dictionary find...
1. philosophy examination of basic concepts: the branch of knowledge or academic study devoted to the systematic examination of basic concepts such as truth, existence, reality, causality, and freedom
... is the philosophy im talking about.

More specifically, traditional western philosophy is the study of 5 fields, i.e. logical, epistemological, ethical/moral, metaphysical, and aesthetic. I've only really studied Ethics, Metaphysics and and Epistemology. I won't go into detail of them coz it'll sound egotisical and preaching.

[Spike]

You must have an extremely high threshold of boredom. LOL.

I once attended a lecture in St. Petersburg (Russia) with metaphysics in the title - a word that sounds like it should be really interesting - I could barely keep my eyes open for the 2 hour endurance. Nothing to do with physics at all.

[Valk]

Maybe you should've learned the language first. :D

I would fall asleep too if someone made funny noices for two hours.

[Spike]

It was in English. :D

[BIGOKE]

Okay I'm starting to get the picture. Philosophy seems to be the domain of those who are students of it, and then become qualified Philosophers..right?? It seems philosophy is too complicated for mere mortals. :evil:

[Aux]

Okay I'm starting to get the picture. Philosophy seems to be the domain of those who are students of it, and then become qualified Philosophers..right??
Philosophy doesn't need qualified students to exist

It seems philosophy is too complicated for mere mortals. :evil:

no

[Shane_Bos]

Okay I'm starting to get the picture. Philosophy seems to be the domain of those who are students of it, and then become qualified Philosophers..right?? It seems philosophy is too complicated for mere mortals. :evil:

The theory of 'Philosophy' as a term itself is fairly simple. Its just sort of thinking about thinking. Which any one and every one can and does do. Its just 'Philosophers', namely the ones with qualifications etc actually study it. But generally, anyone can think or act in a philisophical way, not beyond any one i think you'll agree.

[BIGOKE]

OK so where does one start? Philosophy 101 or Philosophy for dummies? :?

[Aux]

The theory of 'Philosophy' as a term itself is fairly simple. Its just sort of thinking about thinking.

Argh, i hear this definition everywhere and i hate it, such a tiny little part of philosophy is thinking about thought processes and stuff like that. Philosophy is finding a topic and finding base truths, 'thinking' is only one of thousands of topics.

OK so where does one start? Philosophy 101 or Philosophy for dummies?

Search the web and try to find a transcript of Rene Descartes "Meditations on First Philosophy", It's in 4 parts, meditations 1 and 2 are the important ones.

Then after you've read that read Immanuel Kant's "Critique of Pure Reason"

They're the two most famous, Decartes is pretty straight forward, but Kant talks about and critiques other philosphers, so if there's stuff in it that doesn't make sense you just need to go back to the philosophers he's refering to first.

[BIGOKE]

AUX suckered me guys, I've been doing some Philosophical research as he suggested. Now I'm going to eat some humble pie. But first let me declare that I still liked the original idea of this thread being goofy and full of bullshit.

So this whole Philosophy thing seems to me a thing about consciousness, physics and spirituality and reasons for why things are the way they are. Like taking a concept and disecting it down to the smallest reason for why it exists as a concept, and then when you've worked it out, expanding it to include everthing about life.

Or have I cocked it up again?? :x

[Aux]

That's pretty much the idea, and its great to hear that you've taken an interest. The two works that i suggested are on metaphysics, which to me is the most interesting, yet now days its kinda at an end because we've pretty almost figured it out.

Tell me when you've finished the Descartes stuff, coz a discussion on that'd be good.

[BIGOKE]

The homework you gave me was tough so I'll have to go through it again. Really streched the grey matter first time round, just so much to comprehend, and not really conventional everyday language either. :neut: I also went into about 5 other Philosophers works and that were really deep sir. I was drowning somewhat. :puke: And then I finished off with Karl Marx and the communist manifesto. Damn those evil capitalists. :evil:

[ArTee63]

Tis better to have loved and lost than to have never loved at all.

Pretty sappy....but true.

[Valk]

So true :cry:

The danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it. - Michelangelo

[Shane_Bos]

Argh, i hear this definition everywhere and i hate it, such a tiny little part of philosophy is thinking about thought processes and stuff like that.

I was just trying to throw out an 'easy to understand' defenition. Why do you hate it. Although a bit general, its true isnt it? For example, debating existence, that is empiricism and rationalism etc, you cant just jump in head first. You must 'think about thought processes and stuff like that' to form a firm basis or foundation of logic before you can even begin debating.

Not saying Descartes is the best philosopher ever but his 'I think, therefore I am' does this. He was using logic and thought processes to come up with a foundation of knowledge, true or not, he thought about this logic to try and create other truths, hense, thinking about thinking. Just an example but it supports the definition.

Didnt you say yourself that philosophy either has no real definition or has many or something I cant remember.

Anyway, Ive never really critiqued Descartes but if you dont agree, i'll give you a tip. Dont attack the Descartes example, prove the definition wrong. I get tied up in these debates and they attack examples I use which is just plain stupid as the foundations are still there for me to build a reasoned argument on. The best way to win a debate is to knock down the foundations so that there is nothing to build on. I guess you know that though Aux, you seem an intelligent guy, in general, philosphers are :D

[Shane_Bos]

Sorry, that last sentence sounded a bit patronising. Wasnt meant to be. It was a genuine compliment :)

[BIGOKE]

Right on Shane. I sorta came to a similar conclusion as you. Especially about Descartes. I can see that his theories were based on trying to prove the basis of our existence. Also trying to answer the question as to why humans as a species are able to think, reason and make decisions. I understand him to say that although animals have a brain as humans do animals only react to learned responses and have limited choice in those responses, whereas humans have the ability to reason and choose different responses. Anyway i haven't gotten to the point where I can criticize his theories yet. As I understand it he makes a distinction between the mental and physical aspects of life(?) dualism Ithink.

Anyway I'm going to read through his work again just to brush up.

[Aux]

I can see that his theories were based on trying to prove the basis of our existence

'his own' existence, not 'our'. he did sorta go on about some idea of how the external world exists, but it was pretty dodgy and has pretty much been discarded.

and yeah he goes on all about reason and stuff, which is one beef i've always had with a lot of philosophers, they generally say that what separates us from the animals is our ability of reason, which is bullshit if you ask me, anyone who's had an intelligent pet will tell you they are just like humans except they can't talk, and they do posess the ability of reason.

and he was most definatly a dualist.

[Shane_Bos]

what separates us from the animals is our ability of reason, which is bullshit if you ask me, anyone who's had an intelligent pet will tell you they are just like humans except they can't talk, and they do posess the ability of reason.

Yeh my Dog has got an A level in maths and sociology. Hes actually got plenty of hobbies, he loves gardening!

Seriously, animals have the abilty to differentiate pleasure and pain and thats about as complex as they get. They have innate needs such as survival requiring them to eat and sleep etc. If they can reason, wouldnt they reason that they are treated like crap and do something about it?

[Aux]

Your confusing 'intelligence' with 'reason'.

[BIGOKE]

Okay both of you lets stick to the point. Descartes theories have been debunked to a certain extent. But you have got to admire his attempt to draw conclusions that previously did not exist or were never documented. I think he wasn't entirely wrong about humans and animals. Animals for the most part do react automatically to instinct rather than clear reasoning. That is the basis of their survival. Especially the ones lower down in the food chain. Most times their reaction of a split second dont require thought or reasoning. However as you go higher up in the food chain animals definitely have developed some degree of reasoning and cunning. Take lions for example they hunt in groups and communicate almost telepathically. They have the ability to chose their dinner from a menu of hundreds of choices with so much as a glance at each other and then hunt it down in a synchronised effort. That is super intelligence. So in that regard Descartes got it wrong. But we have the benefit of National Geographic and he had a candle and a rat. Because he was the first to put a theory out there it is easy to debunk it now and say it was bullshit. We also have the work of other Philosophers who tried to prove their own theories but also got caught out in contradictions. Anyway thats my contribution for now.

[Shane_Bos]

Your confusing 'intelligence' with 'reason'.

Reason: The capacity for logical, rational, and analytic thought; intelligence.

Intelligence is very much a prerequisite for reason.

With Bigokes example of the lions. I would hardly say that was intelligence, trail and imporvement over the thousands of years theyve existed and evolved more like. Animals learn from experience and their basic needs. For example, they need to eat, so maybe one lion went out one day and couldnt catch anything then another day, some other lion was hungry and two went out at the same time and they found they caught something. Therefore they either hunt alone and starve or hunt together and eat. I doubt they sat there and reasoned that they should hunt together or have this telepathic link. Its was just there basic need to survive mixed with a little experience.

Other than that Bigoke, i agree with what you say about Descartes, hes a dude :mrgreen

[BIGOKE]

Not to labour this but here goes. Lions do have a way of communicating telepathic or not. They usually hunt from 2 sides of a herd and to all synchronise their efforts to one particular target and passing up others in the chase proves that they have communicated and decided which one becomes dinner. Otherwise you would see evidence of five lions bringing down 5 different animals in one hunt. So Shane I have to disagree with you on that one. By the way it is poven with other species too.

Anyway has anyone had their own experience with inward reflection like Descartes did. I remember once I smoked some pot and then I went into a trance while I was looking at myself in the mirror. I started asking myself questions like who am I, Why am i here, Who's God etc. Shit i nearly went bonkers. Its almost as if I went so deep into my mind that I nearly passed out. I had to really bring myself back to reality and rational thought with a monumental effort. I was so messed up after that I haven't done it again. Man there were so many avenues inside my brain i was scared shitless to go back in there, I still am. Anyway happen to anyone else?

[Valk]

Men are such fools.
They only realize how beautiful life is when they are face to face with death.
And even those people are rare.
Some die without knowing what life is.
You’re a fine man.
You’re rebelling against it.
That’s what impresses me.
You’ve been a slave to life.
Now you’re trying to master it.
Man’s duty is to enjoy life.
It’s against God’s will not to do so.
Man must have a lust for life.
Lust is considered immoral but it isn’t.
A lust for life is a virtue

[trugain]

Nice poem, but who is this God character? :roll:

[trugain]

Here is one.

"You can change the page, but it's still the same book."

Relates very good to a lot of stuff.

[wern]

However as you go higher up in the food chain animals definitely have developed some degree of reasoning and cunning. Take lions for example they hunt in groups and communicate almost telepathically. They have the ability to chose their dinner from a menu of hundreds of choices with so much as a glance at each other and then hunt it down in a synchronised effort. That is super intelligence.

I disagree. Lions have existed for thousands of years. Their whole lives are spent hunting and mating. The fact that they choose certain foods and hunt in a group, and also target the same food is a survival instinct that they have developed over thousands of years.

[Tmac 1 LeBron 23]

Be not afraid of a man moving slowly,
But be afraid of a man standing still.

[trugain]

Correct Wern!

Basic instinct, there is no intelligence in picking out the weakest or slowest out of a group of pray. It's just instinct! There is nothing else to it. They are not thinking "well guys you see that one in the middle let's get'em, you go to the right, and I'll come from the left." They are not doing that.

[ColdShroom]

In the end you won't remember the words of your enemies, but the silence of your friends.



Ya gotta keep your feet in, from all the hopping cretins.

[soserious]

Friedrich Nietzsche.
Anyone familiar with his work, what are the best book(s) to read?
I know practically nothing of his work and am hungry for knowledge.

Thankyou,
ss

[zeolite]

Beyond Good and Evil is definitely worth a read. You should be able to find most of Nietzsche's major works in the philosophy section of Waterstone's or somewhere similar if they're not in your local library.