Hmmm

[Valk]

Look at this pic:

http://www.fastmusclegain.com/images/aellis-large2.jpg

Is this for real? The only way a skinny guy could get wider, is to target the side delts. But it looks like those havent grown much. It looks like his frame got wider too. Have they just stretched the image in photoshop or something? :?

[BigBadBear]

He doesn't look dramatically wider and his delts do definitely look bigger in the second one.

However, if the place you got that is trying to sell you something, I suspect foul play...

[JB22]

he definately got wider, but that is entirely possible. His delts have grown substantially, but all before and after pics are altered somewhat...even if its only in the way they take the picture

[Spike]

That's the "Gain Mass In 1 Month" or something like that site.

What I want to know is why his hair's receding so damn fast?

[Valk]

Probaby a side effect of the steroids.

[Bobo]

That's completely normal, not photoshopped at all. Look at how his bones stick out on his shoulders in the "before" pic, and how the new muscle mass covers them in the "after" pic.

I wonder what they're trying to proof with that magazine in his hand...

[Valk]

But it also looks as if his head and waiste got bigger.

[JB22]

new muscle mass would make his wast bigger...adding ab muscles will actually make your waist larger, but more muscualr. his jaw is bigger, but that also tends to happen wiht added muscle mass for some reason. the phot is probably take from a closer distance too to make him look bigger

[Matt]

What I want to know is why his hair's receding so damn fast?

:wink: well spotted.

[Beefeater]

I was gonna post that, but I thought it was just me. :?

[Matt]

I think they are legit photos but waaaaaay more than a month or two in between taking them.

[JB22]

for sure more than a month...that is pretty much impossible to gain that much muscle in that amount of time..let alone doing it while satying lean. In order to gain that much muscle mass, you have to go through a bulk cycle where you will inevitabbly put on fat...than you have to do a cutting phase to get ripped again...no way you can add that much mass and stay lean in a short period of time.

[wern]

definately bullshit unless the site is advertising 'roids. You can probably achieve that with roids.

[outofit]

hey i think i seen this picture before
i think it is eas supplements this guy is taken
im skinny and i used some of it for a week and i gained 8 pounds but it costs too much for me.
i think that mans body changed in probably 6 to 8 months but he had too workout hard for it.
________
CoCo84 live (http://camslivesexy.com/cam/CoCo84)

[Thought Pro]

He's wearing Clocker's hotpants :shock:

[Clockers]

I think they are legit photos but waaaaaay more than a month or two in between taking them.


I would say more then a few months more like a few years!!

[Clockers]

He's wearing Clocker's hotpants :shock:



:shock: :shock:

[Bobo]

A neat trick in those pics, definately! In the "before" pic he's got more hair making his head bigger. In the "after" pic his hair is gone but the head size is visually the same: the pic was taken from a shorter distance. Also the hotpants play a big role in the trick: bigger hotpants makes his body look relatively smaller in the "before" pic, while smaller pants do the opposite. You can see the pics were taken from different distances by the size of the magazine he's holding: in the "before" pic it looks smaller because he's further away. No photoshopping, only some clever visual tricks. But, he does have a lot more muscles in the second one, only not as much as the pic-trick lets us think.

[JB22]

look at the lighting as well. You cant even read the paper in the first pic, but in the after it is clear as day. lots of light eliminates shadows and makes him look less defined, and the must have top light in the second one to add definition shadows.

[Bobo]

True, but still... look at his arms and legs: loads of new muscle mass there.

[JB22]

obviously, but I still refuse to believe that he put that on in one month.

[Bobo]

Who said he did get all that in one month? It's physically impossible unless he got some silicone implants.

[JB22]

That's the "Gain Mass In 1 Month" or something like that site.

What I want to know is why his hair's receding so damn fast?

i dont know if thats right, but if it is, it is impossible

[Valk]

Who said he did get all that in one month? It's physically impossible unless he got some silicone implants.

He states he transformed to from the first to the second picture in 3 months.

[JB22]

ok, that's more believable, but I still think that is an aweful lot for three months. I highly doubt it is true.

[Bobo]

Six months minimum, but they always lie on sites like that. Do they really think those magazines proves anything?! Damn... and some people believe them! :x

[Valk]

Hey, dont call me stupid. I'm not intended to buy anything from that guy. The reason I posted the picture was because it looked as if his shoulder bones got wider, and I thought that was a bit odd.

[Bobo]

I've actually managed to gain some visible muscle mass in 1,5 months, and things really started happening after I begun my big L-Arg/Orn dosage. But, despite the fact that I'm amazed by my own gains recently, I doubt anyone could get that much (the pics) in three months. Body building is like PE'ing: You can only speed up things to a limit with optimal amount of strain.

[Valk]

Lets leave the three months factor out if this for a moment.
If you just look at how a thicker, better shaped body radically transforms a person. From the dorky guy he has changed to the big stud.
I'm an ectomorph and the general advice for ectomorphs is: EAT.
1.5 years ago I tried that but I only gained fat and not much muscle.
And let me tell you; a small framed guy with a decent amount of fat looks just weird. So I am now gathering information about how to do it correctly, but I'm a bit lost. :?

[Bobo]

I used to be really skinny, like a skeleton with only some skin on to cover the bones. I ate like hell... not to get fat, but I was always hungry. Got some nicknames in the army by eating twice the amount others did... guys twice my size... wasn't skinny there anymore but my appetite was still the same. The only way for me to gain some weight was by going to the gym. I see no point in trying to gather fat, it's better to be skinny than carry useless fat around. Go to the gym and eat enough proteins, and You'll get some meat on those bones my friend!

[BigBadBear]

How well were you sleeping? Also, what was your training program like?

I myself have the skinny yet kinda flabby thing going on and it doesn't look right at all... :?

[Bobo]

How well were you sleeping? Also, what was your training program like?
Hmm.. it was a long time ago. I seem to remember I went to the gym every other day, and worked out for ~1-1,5h each time. There was this "power lifting champion" going to the same gym, and he teached us how it's done properly. I've always slept well, except last year.

[Valk]

I myself have the skinny yet kinda flabby thing going on and it doesn't look right at all... :?

Welcome to the club :( :neut: :?

I forgot to mention that during my "insane eating"-period, I DID went to the gym. To let my body grow I kept pumping fuel into my body, but that fuel turned more into fat then into muscle.

[BigBadBear]

Maybe your weights routine wasn't intense enough, or it was too intense. Did you get sick a lot over the period you were training?

For ectomorphs, it's probably best to stick to heavy compound lifts. I suppose the lifts you use will depend on what type of program you're using though. I'm going to be starting a powerlifting routine soon aimed at improving my overall strength so I can start a Martial Art, as I'm in pathetic shape at the moment and wouldn't even be able to compete with kids, let alone grown men.

[Valk]

Yeah, I think one of the problems was that I didnt train hard enough.
I did 2-3 moderate sessions a week.

[JB22]

There is no right way to lift and eat for everyone either. One guy whose skinny could use a program and gain 20 pounds of muscle, and another guy could do the same thing and gain three pounds in the smae time. The key to bodybuilding (just like in PE) is experimenting and finding what works best for you. I used to be really skinny and got pick on all the time when I was 16, but had always lifted, just never got big. But I had continued to study what worked for other people and the science behind it, and eventually developed a program that worked for me. I was about 155 pounds back then, and by the time I was 18, I was 220, and by the time I was 20, I was 255 And maintained the same low bodyfat the entire time. Once I found what worked for me, i just exploded. So dont give up hope, try something for 2 months and if your not seeing results, change it up. You will eventually find what works for you.

[Bobo]

To let my body grow I kept pumping fuel into my body, but that fuel turned more into fat then into muscle.
You were eating too much compared to the intensity of Your workouts. You shouldn't eat just anything, eat healthy... low fat, lots of vegetables... some low fat meat like chicken, eggs... and protein supplements.

[JB22]

dont cut carbs though, cuz they provid the energy your body needs to get the most out of your workouts.

[Bobo]

Yeah, a good recovery drink is always a good idea... and don't forget cardio workouts either, they take care of the excess fat.

[Clockers]

I use to bodybuild years ago i was joined to a gym and yes i took them protine drinks aswell went from a shinny guy to a guy having nice looking muscle's and it only took about 6 months to start seeing improvement of fine muscle i say fine cause if you try to gain muscle mass fast two things are going to happen 1 you will cause injury to your self, 2 if you try to eat alot or take shit to make you gain fast then your fucked cause as soon as you quit working out fat starts to settle in thats why it is so importent to work out eat the right stuff and your protine drink look fellows there are two ways to gain the right way and the wrong way most people have to figure that out for there self's

I know you would like to know the right way good cause any fitness
trainer well tell you not to try and bulk fast it take's time and don't eat fatty shit eat heathy fruits, vegs, protine, heath bars low fat or no fat..and meat No bread..Lift for strength more weight less reps..Not more reps and less weight..you will just be a week dude with some bulk.. :cool

[BigBadBear]

Good advice Clockie. :)

I prefer the powerlifting style of lifting myself too. I'd like to like pretty good and have some real strength to back it up as well rather than just train for pure bulk.

I guess it all depends on your goals though. For me, a powerlifting style routine makes more sense as I want to get strong for Martial Arts too, but for others there may be no real practical needs for extra strength, in which case Bodybuilding will give you mostly looks, but with some strength increase too.

[Bobo]

One good hint to the gym: use the mirrors. Most newbies (~99%) in the gym are ashamed about their "weakness" and start using weights way too heavy for them, causing uneffective ranges of movement and risks of an injury. Look in the mirror and see how weird You look when swinging like a moron with those too big weights. Take 50% off every weight You have been using, and use the full range of movements with every joint. Much more effective that way.

[Shane_Bos]

Bobo, to build muscle though, you need to lift heavy weights. I understand where your coming from but if you lift weights that are too light, it will more 'tone' your body rather then add muscle. You have to find a good weight for you and do less repetitions on larger weights. What i do is start on a light wieght and do lots of reps, then up the weight and do less reps and continue this until i can only do like 4 reps on a large weight, it seems to have worked for me but like everyone says. Everybody is different.

[Clockers]

Yes use them mirrors. :cool

[BigBadBear]

When you're a newbie you should start with low weight or even just the bar to get your form right, I think that's what Bobo was getting at. Being in front of mirrors is helpful for this too as you can see if you're doing something wrong. Getting your form right is very important for when you start slapping more weight on the bar and if you don't get it right to start with it can be hard to 'un-learn' the bad form and will probably hold back your numbers, or even cause you problems with injuries.

Warm-up sets are also important in the interest of preventing injury.

[gonnabefamous]

I only read a few replies but I can shed some good light on this topic. I was a member for his forum for a few months.

He actually addressed this topic, he claimed he never used steroids, that photoshop wasn't even around during the time that was done I believe mid 96 as the body for life he won in 97 and it takes a while to get results and hold the competition the next year and that he had never used steroids but had tried andro, but gave him no results except hair loss. He also claimed he never built up his physique and and then allowed himself to get skinny so he could gain it back fast(muscle memory).

So from what I've seen the points of argument were was photoshop around and good enough to accomplish that in mid/late 96? - I don't know

Did he make a mild confession on the andro especially since in that photo his hair recedes? Possibly but andro is known to cause little results, but then again if you megadose it and have great genetics it possibly could help a lot.

I have his book of gains and he gained about 12 lbs in the first 2 weeks, he claims the bloat in his after pics is due to creatine. I gained 12 lbs in 2 weeks when I was using a heavy oral androgen. I was bloated and most of it was water weight and I usually would top out at the 12 to 15 lb mark even past the 3 or 4 week time mark whereas he gained a total of 32 lbs in 3 months which is the UPPER end of steroid users. I have very crappy genetics. But I can't conceive that someone would have good enough genetics to be able to do that naturally with only creatine. Why hasn't any other person got those kind of results in the body for life? I've seen close, but nothing real close for anyone that hasn't used steroids.

Oh and probably the biggest controversy is that he failed a lie detector test(actually I believe it was inconclusive) among with 2 other guys in the body for life video and Anthony ellis never fessed up on the board on that issue, except denieng he had used it.

Me personally with the lie detector test, admitting used andro, and the fact that on roids you'd be very blessed genetically to get those muscle gains even if you were a noob leads me to believe creatine is not the whole story. ONe more thing, he never has gone higher then 195 at 14% bf, that photo is 170 lbs at 6 percent. He said he doesn't like the bulky look, but for a guy with such awesome genetics why can't he be over 200 lbs at around 10 percent??? When i was using oral steroids I got up to 203 lbs at my peak but I was also 20 percent bf because I have crappy genetics. Why can't a guy with the best genetics for bbing in the world get to 200 lbs with 10% or less? Because he can't without steroids, that's why, and is why he doesn't have the genetics he "claims" to have.

[The Big Banana]

Photoshop came out in 1990. By '96 they were up to version 4.

[gonnabefamous]

OK then I don't know why he brought that up. However I think the photoshop argument is lame because it doesn't look fake plus he really does look like it because when he had to go to body for life he looked like it and he has gained a little more muscle since then. It's much easier to believe he used muscle memory OR he used steroids or he truly has one in a 100 million genetics. Those are the only ways a guy could gain that much muscle that fast, he gained 36 lbs of LBM in 12 weeks because he actually lost enough bodyfat that even though he gained 32 lbs it was actually 36 lbs. Now tell me how the heck he was able to lose a little fat while gaining that much muscle in that time? Most steroid users would DREAM of his results, thats why many have come close but not quite his results of 36 lbs of lbm, ive seen some gain 20 to 25 lbm on the body for life back in it's heyday and that is a miracle and maybe even some of those are questionable. The only guys that I can think of that have made these kind of transformations in a short time are heavy steroid users that are now Professional bodybuilders and they are in the upper echelons of bodybuilding. Markus Ruhl looked fat and chubby but he had some meat on his bones and he got pretty big in a short amount of time AND he didn't start skinny, but he used gear and is one of the top bodybuilders. Funny how this guy can't even get 10 percent BF at 202 lbs with his one in a 500 million genetics whereas a crappy guy like me can use oral steroids and get 202 at 20 percent bf who only a few years earlier was 120 lbs out of high school!! :wink:

[soserious]

Which? why?
Any side effects you noticed personally?

[gonnabefamous]

Which? why?
Any side effects you noticed personally?

m1t, it was legal until they passed the November controlled steroid act to update some prohormones and regular steroids like m1t. That shit was powerful though because it also caused you to retain water like crazy, but I think more lean gains were due to water more then muscle in the end because you would gain it quickly but also lose it faster after you were done. After about 2 weeks I would be swolen as hell, my heartrate would be up, I'd lose my appetite a lot and I'd get out of breath a lot because of the higher blood pressure. I losed my sex drive but I didn't have anyone to be with to worry about I used this stuff so much though over time that it took me like 6 months to really feel like my testosterone levels and sex drive returned. Not good stuff at all for you though, my urine would be dark and I believe it was due to kidney stress as it must cause you to retain water through some mechanism in the kidneys because dark urine is a symptom of kidney strain. Id try to drink a ton of water to keep my kidneys at ease but still it would be dark yellow usually. Now, I'm unemployed and barely taking protein powder now let alone anything hormonal so I've lost a ton of muscle. :( I needed a break from hormones though so I would have been off for this long(about 10 months) anyways probobly....

[soserious]

You in the States? (you said pounds- not kilos or stones)
Sounds like it was pretty shit actually.
So what was up with that?

[Steve Madden]

i agree with matt, its the same person. the adam's apple is slightly left oriented in both pics

[gonnabefamous]

Soserious yeah I'm in the states. Yeah it sort of is shit since a lot of the gains are temporary, but that's the problem with all hormones, is its hard to keep your gains. Now I'm just skinny fat, so I'd like to do the rest I have stashed away occasionally once in a while once I can get back on my feet and be able to take lots of protein and go to the gym more often, Hell I'd look better if I upped my protein intake and cut down the junk food I had been eating for a few months but can't even do that, once I get a good job..... who knows when that will be..... :(

[soserious]

What where you doing? What are you looking for? (I`m unemployed too, since- forever.)
Why you depressed?

[gonnabefamous]

What where you doing? What are you looking for? (I`m unemployed too, since- forever.)
Why you depressed?

Computer science I graduated with, no jobs there so I don't bother looking. I just want a training job, I'd like to get something other then retail, but no one really wants me and there is really no jobs out there for anything I guess unless you know someone, and retail doesn't want me either because I don't have the experience. My brother in law is becoming a manager at a GNC branch, so I might get something there someday through his influence, who knows.....but that's far from a ideal job...